Control
Written by: david988 - 21:06 Aug-29-2019

Control 

BENCHMARK

Rig

Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz

Nividia GTX 1080 8GB

16GB ddr3 1600mhz

Western Digital 1TB

Samsung SyncMaster SA450 24inch 16:10 1920x1200 60Hz

Settings

Far Object Detail- High

Texture Resolution- Ultra

Texture Filtering- High

Shadow Resolution- High

Shadow Filtering- Medium

Volumetric Lighting- High

SSAO- On

Screen Space Reflections Quality- High

Global Reflections- High

MSAA- 4x

Film Grain- On

FPS

min-45

avg.-60

max-90

 


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Name: david988
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What driver did you use?

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the latest ones 436.15

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niQfeglwDZ4 interesting video about control (console versions) from DF they go into the reflections and stuff apperently there is some form of light ray tracing(cone tracing) already baked into the relfections!

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To add more to it the game gets absolutetly hammered on console hardware ps4 dropping as low as 11fps…with people saying there are massive stutters and freezes(probably due to the HDD's in consoles) and horrible load times due to HDD(i have like 5 seconds load times) and someone even saw it drop to 8fps with huge

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levels and fight scenes in some parts the game spawns a lot of enemies basically unplayable performance! So yeah if you got hardware comparable to consoles atleast in some ways (not that many people have) you are looking at 30fps as the best case scenario or even lower in some parts the game is also poorly optimized

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Well consoles… I mean xbox one s still has ddr3 memory and first gen gcn… No wonder it underperforms so many years later.

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I think its also an issue of them running out of bandwidth as they say in the video and you can also see it happening that similar effect happens when you run out of VRAM on the GPU on a PC game with loading the VRAM with too much textures something i experienced in RE2 with my rx480 by maxing the vram out it's horribl

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And when theyre doin that fps test both of those areas drop my fps by about 20-40% both of them are the most demanding areas ive run into so far dippin me even below 60 on the mins down to 50…its crazy how some areas are completely unoptimized but others run fine that power plant area and that atrium area are brutal

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Yeah, when you run out of Vram you fall back to system memory which is much slower. But on consoles the Vram and the system ram are not really separate so when a console runs out if memory it goes to hdd maybe?? That would absolutely destroy the performance.

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I am surprised how such issue passed the QA… One would think that optimising vram on fixed hardware isnt something of great challenge.

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Its no wonder they only showed the PC footage prior probably running it on a 9900k system with an rtx 2080ti…if anyone saw console footage like this it sure would have changed a lot of peoples mind i mean all you have to do is go over to the remedy forums people are pissed you know since epic has no forums Xd

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Also the consoles have like what the base has a 7870 ish and the pro/one x has rx 570 ish i mean idunno about the 7870 but i know the rx 570=rx480 still holds up really well at 1080p 60fps high/ultra in most games i played earlier this year(except for metro and a few) … i believe its the CPU thats an issue

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Also no i explained it wrong or perhaps you read my comment wrong they're not running out of VRAM they're running out of memory bandwidth or cpu bandwidth so not the vram but something else is the problem. The hitching/skipping that occurs is similar to what happens when you run out of VRAM on PC by filling it with

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too many textures. But the thing is this game barely uses over 3GB of VRAM on max settings so clearly the consoles arent running out of VRAM. Theyre running out of bandwidth on the CPU side or the memory (RAM) side but nevertheless the issue still looks similar to what happens when you run out of VRAM but thats not it!

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And i know RAM and VRAM are shared on the consoles but dont they have 12GB? Im really not sure what is the issue or what's happening but i dont think its the VRAM and theres no way this game is filling up 12GB especially since the console version looks like medium settings or low even so idunno

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yeah the cpu is a problem too


the xbox one s has 12 CUs with only 68.22 GB/s memory bandwith with 8gb ddr3


the ps4's main advantage that it uses 8 gb gddr5 and a more mature gcn2.0 gpu with 18 CUs and 176.0 GB/s memory bandwith


the ps4 pro uses a lower clocked rx480 equivalent with 36 CUs and 8gb gddr5 on 217.6 GB/s bandwith.


the xbox one x is the strongest it has a gpu with 40 CUs activated and 12gb gddr5 on 326.4 GB/s bandwidth it is stonger than an rx580 in theory


not sure about the cpus ill check

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I have no idea how the memory gets allocated between the cpu and the gpu, but 8GB memory is not too much for both cpu and gpu to share.

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ok so both xbox one (s) and X use the same cpu an 8core amd jaguar cpu clocked at 1,7 ghz (lol) while the X version has it clocked at 2,3 ghz

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turns out the ps4/pro has actually weaker cpu
it uses the same thing clocked lower, 1.6 ghz / 2,14 ghz

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the 5400 rpm hdd isn't helping either :D

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Yeah 8GB shared isnt a lot probably why they are packing the new ones with 24 although even that isnt a lot they should do 32 but they will probably "update" them again in 2,3 years. Even my phone has 1,8-2,4Ghz clock speed with 8 cores Dx I hope new ones have a baby 3700 even if its running only at 3Ghz :P

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Also another thing i found out that running the game at 1440p resolution and 1080p render resolution esentially upscaling it restores a lot of performance loss with minimal quality/visual loss. It appears from everything ive read 1440p seems to be killer here even 2080tis are falling below 80fps with no RTX on.

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It really does look very good but damn it is so demanding, my poor 1060 probably couldn't manage 30 FPS

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Remedy did an amazing job with the looks of this game but it's a real demanding cookie i would say it stacks up there with Exodus for me in terms of performance numbers so if you played that with your system your numbers should be the same probably within 30-60fps at 1080p? dx11 of course but this is guesswork :)

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Maybe in a few years we can replay it with max settings :)

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It runs okay for me at 1440p 60fps avg max settings(same as exodus) (msaa=off) bigger areas at 80fps avg give or take. But i assume you meant turning RTX on? Then yeah thats a whole other story XD more like 20-30FPS with everything maxed out there Probably only the 2080Super/2080ti can do 60+ with everything on max XD

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you can play it just medium settings i at medium have 110fps and at low 150fps so you would have 60 at medium no problem

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yeah, dx12 is a stuttering mess (at least with my 1070)

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Yeah dx11 always runs better for me whether it be exodus,re2 or this game but if you got RTX cards you are kinda stuck with dx12 if you want RTX ON! of course for me its gonna be RTX OFF! always atleast for a few years

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Lighting looks as if it's DXR/RTX/ray tracing, no?

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Nope standard lighting you are looking at screen space reflections and global reflections they are very good/detailed in this game i havent seen RTX atleast only from screenshots but it seems pointless with how good this game already looks in the lighing department.

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Oh and volumetric lighting of course with a bit of SSAO. I dont know which SSAO this is since it's only labeled "SSAO" but it doesnt seem like hbao+ its a pretty light version of it imo the lighing is top notch and reflections are much better than quantum breaks reflections were in 2016. But to each is own Dx

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The game has some RTX as StevenPlebster said, but I was wondering if it's on or off as I really can't see the difference at all and was wondering if that is the performance he is getting with or without ray tracing on as I don't see any of the settings mentioning ray tracing.

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He's got a 1080 he cant turn RTX on and neither can i while i have better performance at 1440p but only slightly better this game hammers performance at max even with or without 4xmsaa (only seems to hit by about 25%) what im getting is 50min,65avg,80max and in smaller areas like the first level 70min,85avg,102max

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And yes i KNOW tehnically i can run ray tracing and so can david but trust me it destroys performance i didnt bother enabling it but i assume im gonna get less than 15 fps maybe 30 at best and yes stuff like 1660ti or whatever can also do RTX basically pascal/turing can do it but turing has much less of a hit than

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I believe only realtime reflections are using DXR in this title.

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Yep only the realtime reflections use it but there are many static relfections or however you wanna say it also quantum break was very good at showing off reflections too. Imo unless you wanna see like videos ingame or something reflected inreal time the standard stuff looks amazing already

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The game is definitely a looker. Most of the surfaces seem to be reflective and I think RTX works on moving debris and characters during combat. Also from the screenshots I've seen of the game, glass windows reflect the background realistically as well.
I wouldn't say RTX is necessarily going to add much to this title even in terms of reflections as baked in ones are pretty good already.

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I know that the game has RTX, but I can't tell the difference when they are on or off and I'm also wondering if that is the performance with RTX on or off.

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He's got 1080 so I'd bet its without RTX.

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without i forgot that this is on dx11 and ray tracing is only avalible with dx12 + you can see peformance i got that should be answer enouth is it ray traced or not

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Cmon Psycho how could he have it on he has a 1080 XD. He cant enable RTX but as ive said the reflections look this good in the game by default all RTX seems to add from what ive seen is REAL time reflections like video in game playing on walls or objects they did like a video on Nvidia's channel showing it off

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Well it's not really an answer, for example just chatting with NeoGPX, a gtx 1660Ti can run BF5 with DXR/RTX on high settings and all the other settings on high at 1080p and get 40-70fps…


So you don't need a rtx GPU to run ray tracing as long as it's not heavy.

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But yeah with DX11 that answers my question.

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yea 10 and 16 series can run rtx but quit poorly didnt you saw my Quake RTX Benchmark?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iZjQQtpoyI&t=244s

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Quake has heavy RTX.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxSgF4qoiIE
Look at BF5 for example. At high settings, high DXR/RTX settings you can run it with a gtx 1660Ti at 1080p with 40-70fps.

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Time stamps in the description.

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That's highly unlikely. I call bull on that claim. I really doubt 1660Ti can run RTX on high at 40-70 and get the same performance as 2060 Super.

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Look at the video I sent above.

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Yeah I stand corrected on that. It's interesting.

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I call bullshet on that video to me it looks like 2060 performance 1660ti has lower performance than the 1080ti with DXR https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkY-20kdXl0 skip to 10:30

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And thats the best case scenario for the 1080ti while standing on a train at 1080p resolution and doing nothing both the 2060 and 1080ti are closer to 30fps while on avg with RTX on high. the 1660ti is more of a 15fps on high card. at 1440p the 1080ti gets murdered and theres no point to turning it on honestly

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I now don't know what to believe.
I'd guess BFV's implementation is a little less demanding maybe?

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Here is more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNzi8jJ4VWc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPMqaGnGRco


I doubt everyone is lying.


@StevenPlebster
Ray Tracing got nerfed hard in most games it was implemented after launch to make it run better on GPUs and as I've said many times as it stands ray tracing is a gimmick. In the future when they do it better it will become good, but we will still be sacraficing extra GPU performance for it.

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So yes in BF5 it's quite lite, until you set it on ultra.

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Also there is that little thing called drivers… nvidia never TRULY supported their previous gen gpus ever since Kepler…

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Metro exodus XDDD 8 fps lul okay it appears exodus smashes it the most but i will try turning it on since these are reflections but i expect to go down to 30 with how demanding this game is in general i dont have a lot of headroom but i also dont see the point either with how good reflections already look.

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And i cant verify the BFV numbers since i dont own that game and i wont pirate it just to run the ray tracing in it i dont care ill report by how much my fps drops in this game since they both use reflections i cant say those video are all lies but i dont trust them personally the exodus numbers are correct though

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Yup metro in general even with RTX off smashes even RTX 2080 Supers at 1080p! The RTX 2080 Super at 1080p ultra no ray tracing in metro gets 62fps average, so yeah, not surprised that the gtx 1660Ti is not doing well.

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tell me about it it's the goddamn sand level/desert area. At 1440p in the opening area im getting nearly a 100fps avg and then boom you get to the volga and sand levels and 60fps here we come it is similar in Control aswell the open areas smash performance by 20-40% even though these levels are much smaller than exodus

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Probably, my point was mainly about battlefield 5, but the second and third video I sent had other games I couldn't find another BF5 only gtx 1660Ti video.


As I said if the RTX is light even non-RTX GPUs can run it.


And since I can't tell the difference between RTX on and off visually in Control I asked if it was on or off.

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Yeah your question makes more sense now but its off i can tell the game looks similar to what my final image is also no such luck with RTX here when everything is enabled and maxed out im getting below 30FPs mostly 20-30FPS. I found someone with 1080ti footage at 1440p and his numbers are in line althought he is about

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20% lower since hes running high settings aka 4xmsaa aka ultra since thats what they max out but its demanding as hell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xTFXUYQu-c Oh and yeah you CANNOT turn that fakin motion blur off I TRIED everything even messing with the .ini no such luck its extremely ugly and annoying

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His 1080ti is running hot as hell though btw 84C might not be hot for some GPU's but it is hot for Pascal so his frequency is a bit lower im running 2k Mhz and above usually at 65C. So my numbers are 20-40% higher in this "opening" level but my god that second level smashes it just like exodus with a avg 60 fps perf

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Pretty much 2080 super levels since the 2080 super is just an overclocked 2080 and im running a decent overclock here and yeah i guess you could also overclock the 2080 super and push it past 2,000Mhz aswell although apperently it does better with memory overclocks

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Damn that much of a hit in performance I swear if not running side by side I can't tell if RTX is on or off and even when running side by side I often don't even see a difference in some areas… not worth it at all for this game imo.


And if the rtx 2080 super benefit from memory overclocks it means it's starved for bandwidth, which is sad, because that means we need GDDR7/GDDR6X… or perhaps HBM3/HBM2E.

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fakin nvidia and amd can we please atleast get 80-100% boost next gen? Otherwise im gonna be running at 30fps next year and i imagine even 2080ti owners but i guess people will say turn down settings i feel like when you spend for the high end you should get high end performance? But its obvious its no longer the case

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Well the question is NOT of "can", but of… of… what they are willing to give us…


Like The RX 5700XT if it was priced correctly at 300-330$, it would have been a 70-80% improvement over the rx 590 for about the same price considering that gddr6 is 11$ per GB and GDDR5(X) is 6.5$ per GB and that the rx 5700xt has a 8% bigger die… But AMD have increased their profit margins. From 2012 to 2016 they operated on 23% gross profit margins, in 2017 it's 34% and in 2018 it's 38% and that's gross profit margins, the GPUs and CPUs are selling at higher profit margins that the gross profit margins and according to their 2018 financial report they expect even higher profit margins for 2019…

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AMD's R&D in 2012 was slightly lower than the R&D in 2018 and their total expenses in 2012 were actually slightly higher than in 2018… btw… and in 2011 they were much higher, even higher in 2010… and yet they sold us 350$ 6970sat 389mm^2 in times where they were releasing a new architecture every year… oh well…

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When it comes to ray tracing chances as that instead of extra cuda cores just in general instead of having higher cuda core count they will add more ray tracing cores, so at least we might not get any performance drop from ray tracing in some games? Perhaps…


But affordable(200-400$) and well performing ray tracing GPUs? Not any time soon and even when the time comes, we'd be missing extra performance due to there being ray tracing cores instead of more cuda cores.

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The numbers MASON what do they mean ?!?! xD but yeah i think you know what im talking about here if im getting 30FPS in next years games so will the 5700xt since its like what 5-10% slower than standard 1080ti. I dont think we will fall that far certainly not at 1080p but i really hope next years or two years GPU's

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are a lot faster. I dont care too much for price or how much im getting milked i just want higher performance. obviously i dont wanna pay 1,3K for shet like 2080ti but seriously 80-100% uplift or there is no point of purchasing GPU hardware and yeah affordability and GPU's isnt the case anymore nvidia and now amd are

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trying to kill affordability. Sure the 5700xt looks good in context compared to 590 or whatever rx card but its already aging like an old ripe fruit. Truly affordability has gone down the drain as well as performance uplifts with it

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Hey from this I'm finally happy that someone gets that you need at least 80-100% performance improvement to call it an upgrade.


In the past 5 years, people have been conditioned to think that 15-30% is an amazing performance increase and it's not, it's garbage…


Also the rx 5700XT would look great compared to the rx 590 if it didn't cost 400$, but 300$


And both performance uplifts and affordability have gone down the drain due to people buying everything AMD, intel and Nvidia sh!ts out…


AMD, Intel and Nvidia can make huge performance uplifts every generation(2-3x years), but they choose not to, so that they can milk us and instead spread it out for a longer period of time, in times where they all are getting record income, sales and everything… just like AAA companies

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But also yeah as a final note you saw the video with the 1080ti right? It looks really good even without RTX on you can see relfections everywhere visible when he gets near the "shelter" door sure its a bit blurry and it isnt as clear as when RTX is on but imo its still fine. Yeah RTX slashes my fps in half BUT

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perhaps nvidia will release a driver to mitigate some issues. The thing about comparing this game to BFV is this game has 5 options for ray tracing (i dont know how many BFV had) it's got all of these: RTX reflections, RTX transparent reflections,RTX indirect diffuse lighting,RTX contact shadows and RTX debris

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So it's got all three of the usual suspect: GI,shadows and reflections aswell as debris. It makes sense why this hammers performance by 50-60% compared to BFV's light hit(i dont know what it is) as this game uses all 3 forms of RTX. The actual with RTX on is noticable but imo not necessery as the game looks great

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And yes, just goes to show that even without Ray Tracing we have amazing reflections and lighting, which is one of the many reasons I'm against Ray Tracing until there are NO negatives about it, even if it looks worse.


And as I said Nvidia never Trully supports older architectures, sorry mate.


Same with AMD, but they were stuck on GCN for 8 years, so it's not like they had anything else to support. :D
The hd6000 and older series got proper support dropped all the way back in 2013 though, and "official" support dropped in 2015…

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Also i forgot to mention there are presets for RTX levels too and if i turn off the GI or better known as RTX lighting and RTX transparent reflections and put it on "high" my fps hit isnt that bad. Went from 60avg to 40-45avg with 35mins. Still this game is annoyingly diffcult and id like to maintain 60+fps atleast

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Actually i found a good compromise for keeping RTX ON! Everything except the RTX indirect lighting i have on and on high and i turn the render resolution to 1080p and resolution to 1440p so basically it's upscaling it and this way i sacrifice a bit of image quality for much better performance and i can keep RTX on

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running at 60fps avg on max (no lighting setting) thats not too bad. But if i touch that lighting setting im dropping down to the 40s on avg again…either way the only good looking things are the reflections,shadows and debris flying around. the GI present in the game already looks good enough with RealTime GI.

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This game struggles hard when running native and especially at 1440p people even with 2080ti's are dropping down to 75fps on avg without RTX. It appears to have the same issue as quantum break where its better to run a slightly lower resolution adn then upscale sacrifice image quality and gain a lot of performance back

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nice. I agree balancing the settings in demanding games to achieve best visuals for the performance is much better than just using the medium/high/ultra preset.

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Also take a look at the video i linked above if you have time it's from digital foundry on the console versions of the game there is already some form of ray tracing baked into the reflections probably why they look even better than QB's did (cone tracing) i will say after spending with with RTX in this game it might

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be the only one that has a good version of it in. I think it probably comes down to the fact that Remedy actually put the time in to make the reflections look a lot better over the static/cube map ones while those look good the RTX cleans up those rough-shadowy outlines a lot and reflects videos played in game off of

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mirrors/mirrored surfaces. The shadows are cleaned up a bit but honestly they look amazing already shadows might be the most useless one i barely noticed the difference in SOTTR i cant comment on the lighing as i couldnt get it to run at above 30-40fps in either exodus or this game but the default GI already looks good

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yeah I saw it, it's brutal. XD

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Yeah and they tested those two specific areas i have had performance issues in aswell those too are brutal and probably the worst performing areas of the game so far. Either way they did a great job with the reflections here but im sure DF will do a video on the PC version and RTX and all the modes of it

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Also i dont know if youve seen this but AMD's marketshare is higher than Nvidia's since q1 2014 Dx Team Red is on the rise it's actually scary reviewers gave Zen2 good reviews and then NAVI got good reviews compared to Super cards and now everyone thinks they're an amazing deal Dx Maybe Nvidia will wake up finally…

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Oh whoops it was q3 2014 but here is the link about it https://wccftech.com/amd-overtakes-nvidia-marketshare-q2-2019/ oh and another pro tip if you're gonna read this later dont read the comments. I already got stage 4 terminal cancer just by glancing at them this type of stuff always brings out the worst trolls

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Yeah I saw. Which just proves my point, people buy what those unqualified reviewers tell them to buy… -_-


Also the age of high-quality AMD GPU PCBs is over… I thought the RX 5700(XT) will have a scaled down Radeon VII PCB, which uses high-end components…


Nope it turns out that the RX 5700(XT) PCBs either use 5 phase medium quality VRMs and controllers or use 10 super low-end quality VRMs and controllers….


Which means that the RX 5700(XT) has very, very cheap PCBs, which means that they are even more overpriced than I thought they are.


If I go and analyse the RX 5700XT PCBs, I wouldn't be surprised if it's 20-30$ TOTAL…


Basically AMD GPU PCBs are now the same quality as Nvidia's…

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of course there are good 3rd party PCBs if you want to pay RTX 2070 Super money for a rx 5700XT(500-530$ without the TAXes)…

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So basically the RX 5700XT's 251mm^2 die is 100$ at 0% profit margin.


The PCB is let's say 25$(in the middle between 20 and 30) without bulk discount, the stock cooler is 5$…


88$ for the 8GB GDDR6 VRAM without bulk discount.


The card for AMD at 0% profit margin without bulk discounts is roughly 218$.


I don't count Bulk discounts as AMD gets bulk discounts, but then they make bulk discounts. My mother's store gets 13% bulk discount for 800-1000 units bought in bulk, I imagine that bigger stores that order more get 20% and AMD gets around 20%.

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At best it shoulda been like a 350€ for the 5700xt instead of the current 550€ AIB models sit at for me… i bought the rx 480 for like what 230€? 280€ was the 8GB model thats an amazing perfm jump considering 5700xt isnt that far off the my 1080ti at worst 5-15% slower but it costs the same and the 2070S was l

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Yes, but the difference is that the rx 480 had a PCB with higher quality than most gtx 1080s and even gtx 1080Tis, the rx 5700/XT has normal/mid-range to even sub-mid-range quality PCB.


Just like you said 3rd party RX 5700XT at best(for AMD), at worst(for us) should have been 350 euro, not 550 euro for a ASUS strix 5 phase GPU that indeed has high quality compontents but it's a two stage 5 phase…


And the reason RX 5700XTs can't clock higher on both the core and ESPECIALLY on the Memory is the crappy VRMs and PCB design… I thought clocks were process node limited, they are NOT, they are crappy PCB limited…

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was like 650€ all of these choices suck for the price and they all perform the same i think on paper i like a bigger vram buffer and 1080ti has faster memory even the gddr5x on it is faster than gddr6 overall higher clocks but meh in practise all 3 cards perform similarly or within 10-20% of each other

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Yes both the Pulse and Evoke only models that are even out yet i know i saw the red devil havent watched a review of it (its also not avalaible) on the strix you mean theyre doing 5x2 parallel VRM's right? That's ASUS favourite thing now even my mobo has it lowers transient response but typically VRM's run hotter due

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to the nature of lower phase count. In practise or daily use its only like 10C higher than normal nothing crazy but lower transient response is better imo i dont like stupid 16 phases where you can make coffee before the final load voltage sets in its super annoying for overclocks but it does keep temps slightly lower

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They put two power stages and two inductors on one PWM signal, instead of having each a PWM signal, yes.

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But then again you sacrifice ripple effect which is always higher or bigger on lower phase count imo its a necesseary sacrifice ripple doesnt tend to cause issues with OC's where as a high transient response sure does. it doesnt matter if you ripple a lot if you are only ripplin for less than few MS. But if it takes

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forever to reach the final voltage you are almost always required to dial in higher voltages to adjust for the transient response to collect it's shet. But thats where my knowledge of VRM's ends there is a lot more that goes into it but ASUS "new" design theyve been using for 2 or 3 years is atleast better than doubler

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doubler or doubled phases gigabyte typicially runs i understand why and yeah temps will be lower even on a doubler a bit since with parallel VRM's you are esentially packing them with 2 power stages (they use even 3 power stages) so they BUFF a lower phase count into oblivion. In some cases they overload them with pha

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Yeah, but the problem in ASUS's case is the lack of capacitors… so there will be higher ripple even with those 2 stage 1 PWM high-end phases… so sad… -_-


And yes I know that they love to use 1x PWM signal for two phases, they've been doing that since 2014 actually.

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Changing the topic for a second: Windows update just killed my friend's SSD who else got his ssd killed by a windows update? ?_?


I told him to unplug it, run the PC, then stop the PC, plug it in the same port and try again and then repeat that, but plug it in another port, but I will probably have to go and see his PC in person or he'll have to bring hig PC to me…

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Yeah the ripple is always higher its a sacrifice they basically risk everything for lower transient response and it ends up working a lot better over gigabytes low ripple higher phase count solution (gigabyte seems to have the "best" VRMs on paper currently but performance is lacking on their GPU's and boards

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HOLY SHET IT JUST HAPPENED TO TZZSM a few days/weeks ago HOW IS THIS HAPPENING TO EVERYONE Dx he said it was bricked and it was an 860 evo with 5 year warranty so he sent it to get repaired

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Wait theyre lacking capacitors? Please dont tell me they actually put less than 16 on the strix? fakin imbecils if they actually did that maybe they could get away with 14 or 12 but they are overloading the phases… 5x2 should atleast have a good overhead on top if it like 16? or am i incorrect on this?

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Unless they are running those new fancy 70Amp power stages like on x570 but that shet is expensive and knowing asus they wont stick that in anything under the 2070Super or 2080Super

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They are running those "smart" power stages that are rated for 60AMPs, but can actually go up to 72-74AMPs, but they got only 7 capacitors on the front-end(5 of which are for the Vcore phases), 10 caps on the back-end and they should be 10 caps on both the front-end and back-end…

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Ah theyre the 60AMP ones those are still solid "smart" not sure Dx but only 12 in total? Stupid the ripple might be bad but which PCB are we talking about here this is the 5700xt right? i kinda got lost cause i slightly remember watching buildzoids video on it (idunno if you know him) and he said the strix looked good

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cause they put something on it that allows you to basically kill the card LOL

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yes it's the rx 5700XT Strix and IDK what they put on it that can kill the card… Are you referring to the header-slots where you can monitor the voltage and increase it? Sure it's cool, but that's for LN2 as the PCB isn't good enough to do anything with air, maybe custom water cooling loop with a good plate?

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Powercolor is running 50AMP power stages… but it's a doubler and thus an actual 10 phase and has 10 capacitors both in the front-end and back-end, but the components are basically sub-mid-range quality if not even high-ish low-end quality… though they can get away with it due to the doublers, still doesn't matter… as AMD used to have top notch high-end components on their Reference PCBs and almost all 3rd party boards, except the super cheap ones.

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The Sapphire Pulse RX5700XT has probably the best PCB considering that it costs only 10$ more than the reference. It's got good mid-range components all around all the necessary capacitors, it has no doublers, no two stage one pwm signal, just stright forward mid-range PCB done right and with dedicated radiator for the VRM under the big cooler as they knew it needed it.

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A doubler will still perform worse than parallel but the issue is Powercolor can get away with cheaping out on capacitors while asus cant and theyre still doing it cause they only reserve their best stuff for top end line which is stupid product segmentation by them as always.

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Yeah Sapphire did the smart thing with the pulse i like what they did with the bracket MSI was smoking crack and cut VRAM thermal pads in half and the VRAM temps were high as shet

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Techpowerup has the PCBs btw, but you have to zoom and squint to see the components XD

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Also im not sure if you are familiar with this guy but he's basically a resident VRM expert if you will this is what he said about the STRIX's VRM skip to around 8:00 mark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioJHGyivLpQ&t=50s

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Yeah it's really hard too see as shet usually i end up watching a vid this dude uploads you can get a better look at the STRIX PCB in the video Dx my vision isnt the best when trying to read really text Xd

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I died laughing… MSI did what? They put too think thermal pads? rookie mistake if I say so myself and I do, as I've done it on a RRoD Xbox 360 when some 10 years ago when I was trying to fix my THIRD Xbox 360… gj microsoft…

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Where does he get the Trise and Tfall temperatures to calculate the Watts? I'd love to know as I usually search way too long like crazy and he appears to have them. O_O

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Mothereffer is a genius im not sure what field he works in but you can find countless videos about hardware and especially VRM analysis and stuff pretty good guy to use for VRM reviews although he's not always 100% accurate as noone can be from pictures and without actual testing but he does good analysis

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But I can do it myself. PCBs aren't complicated, I just can't find all the stats usually and he has them.


With the stats I can do it myself in 2-3x minutes, instead of watching a 40 minute video… Otherwise yes, he seems great for PCB reviews and he has tons of stats that I can't get, probably has good connections with the manufacturers and 3rd party AIB manufacturers.

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Oh my god it's actually even worse you can see it in this video they're fakin clows for what they did https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=morJq0HJoCc skip to around 12:45 LUL they cut them IN HALF

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Hahahaha XD
Damn… This is so sad… that's why do what Sapphire does and actually make a dedicated VRM cooler/radiator… simple solution, works best.

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Yeah they couldnt fit it onto the same heatsink so that had this genius plan of "HEY LETS JUST CUT THE PADS IN HALF GUYS" and save a few pennies and let the VRAM run hotter cause you know atleast the card is brown gold right? right guys… Dx Sapphire is atleast reliable even on pulse which is "cheaper" unit

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Also he has a powercolor video on the 5700xt unfortunetely still no Sapphire Nitro still no word of anything about it remeber when they said NAVI was getting all AIB's in mid august yeah it's september in 2 days and so far only pulse is in stock for me XD

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Dude I'd pick the Pulse over the Strix in terms of quality even if the Pulse is cheaper, if I had to choose, straight up quality design with mid-range quality components with proper cooling for everything. Now not if I'm L2 overclocking, but egh… it's LN2 overclocking…

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Still only reference RX 5700(XT)s here, and they cost 460-500 euro… -_-

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I never said you should buy the Strix Dx just said he also has a vid on the powercolor red devil unit. Oh nvm its the 5700 that has the evoke and pulse models the 5700xt is only reference for 480€ lul

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Oh I know you didn't, I'm just saying in general :D


Yeah I'm skipping this gen and potentially next generations until the market becomes at least semi-consumer friendly… at this point I've just given up on them…


That's why I love chinese companies, they always come in and are brutally competitive and sell at low profit margins(the profit margins they NEED, not WANT)… Too bad that to make USA GPUs and x86-64 CPUs you need licenses and patents… :/

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Might actually get a second hand GPU if things don't get better next year/net gen of GPUs. But nobody in my country will buy a rx 5700(XT) or RTX 2060… most people buy up to 200-250 euro GPUs, which to be honest is normal, but we have no 200-250 euro GPUs from the current generation…


Well AMD and Nvidia helping the console market it seems and only AMD will benefit from it(and Nvidia from the switch now that I think about it).

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*USA as in Unified Shader Architecture, NOT United States of America(just in case, as it is potentially confusing, every time I read it I think of the country first XD).

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Wait really you dont have any rx 580's and rx 590s most of these are still going strong in my country atleast the Sapphire Nitro and Pulse ones are 1660ti and the likes are also here but theyre a lot more expensive 350+ range only a 1650 is 200-250€ but speaking of that garbage fire card Nvidia is apperently

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making a 1650 TI version you know after they said you would be crazy to not buy an RTX card. But then they keep making low end crap cards like the 1650 i mean tehnically maybe the 1650ti wont suck? But there is a big gap between 1650 and 1660/1660ti so idunno what nvidia is doing here honestly so many FAKIN GPU's

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Oh and i meant the rx570,580 are around 150-250€ depending on the 4GB or 8GB and these are brand new cards of course Pulse or Nitro it would be a decent stop gap for your aging 380 honestly it would allow atleast close to 60 and probably over 60 with high or medium settings in most games theyre still great cards

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I can't get away with a rx 580, my resolution is 2580x1080 and I want my GPu to be capable at 2x more years(or at this point even 3x years, sadly), the rx 580/590/570 aren't good for even regular 1920x1080 in demanding games.
And the gtx 1650Ti is 220 euro in my country… and still not good enough. The gtx 1660Ti is close to 400 euro(340-385 euro) and probably the bare minimum I need for 2580x1080…

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Or of course you could just end up waiting if AMD releases a 5600xt or 5600 i imagine those will still be like 300-350€ since there is a gap at that price range for AMD cards and you probably arent in a hurry to upgrade anyway :P

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I've been in a hurry to upgrade since 2017, but with the rtx GPUs and the RX 5700 GPUs they literally killed my interest in upgrading my GPU.(I've saved up the money too, but nah…)
And I was hoping for Zen2 to be at least 30-40% faster per core so that Zen3 could be another 10-20% faster than that and I could upgrade to Zen3, but nope(will probably upgrade to it anyway, but still)… huge disappointment by AMD's accountants, CEO and management…


The GPU market is a lot worse and alot more anti-consumer…