All the noise coming from Nvidia of late has pointed towards its imminent mobile GeForce GTX 1070 and GeForce GTX 1080 graphics cards beyond, pound for pound, exactly the same specs as their desktop counterparts. It means, for the first time ever, there is no performance difference between desktops and laptops, at least a stock speeds.
This is a game changer. Going mobile has its own set of pros and cons, but the weaker performance stood out like a sore thumb. Now you no longer need to sacrifice frames per second or resolution while playing on the go. In theory you’ll be able to buy a laptop with a GTX 1080 and absolutely smash through DOOM in 4K. You can voyage to Skellige at 60 frames per second. All from the comfort of your toilet. What a time to be alive.
Such things come with a cost of course. We still have zero idea just how much Nvidia intends to charge for its mobile chips. Nvidia is rumoured to be dropping the ‘M’ nomenclature entirely however. So rather than a GTX 1080M, it will simply be a GTX 1080, another surefire sign of just how similar these units will be to the desktop GPUs.
The ideal scenario would be them costing the same price, but cramming that hardware into a smaller footprint is likely to result in Nvidia jacking up the price. Still, it would surely be worth paying a small premium.
I know of course that many will still choose to stick with their desktops. There lies superior cooling, larger chassis, and overclocking capabilities that just wouldn’t be possible in a notebook for fear of overheating. There’s also the small matter of upgrades to consider. Spend $2000 on a notebook and that’s pretty much it. Once it’s out of date you might as well throw it in skip. Using a desktop it would just be a simple upgrade. On the flip side, with mobile chips matching their desktop counterparts, it does also mean high-end laptops will have much longer lifespans than they would before.
If Nvidia can pull through on delivering mobile performance matching desktop, at least on a base level, then on a personal level this would make my next upgrade a tricky decision. Normally I'm all about cheap laptops and a decent gaming PC, but if both could rolled into one for a reasonable cost then the landscape of PC gaming could well change forever.
What do you think, is there any chance of desktops fading away in favour of more portable hardware? If you were to buy a brand new PC, would it be a desktop or a laptop? Let us know why!
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There's still need of making equivalent Processor and other components like RAM. I'd buy Desktop coz If I'm capable of buying GTX 1080, I'd also be capable to having 32-64GB RAM and a 4GHz processor which is not present in today's Laptops.
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Actually my laptop which used the last of MOBILE Intel chips could go to all the way up to 4.5GHz OC'd. Laptops TODAY are using DESKTOP CPUS, RAM and regular HDDs/SSDs and are even available with DESKTOP GPUs in SLI even (MSI Titan GT80 Anniversary features desktop GTX 980 in SLI). My mobile-part laptop also has 32GB RAM, although today with desktop DDR4 you can go with 64GB and more in a laptop if you want to.
You need to look around more :P
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Wow! I didn't knew that! Is that a Workstation or a Gaming Laptop?
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Gaming laptop. Most 'fat' gaming laptops these days are fully upgradeable and have desktop parts. Some companies that make these: Eurocom, Sager, MSI, Clevo, Origin, etc.
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Heck yeah... There are a few of us here around Game Debate that have laptops that can be upgraded. Mine is closer to what Xquatrox had before his recent upgrade. Oh I am not talking about his uber desktop that is listed now. I am talking about his laptop with an i7-4930X & 980M SLI. We both are sporting 32GB of RAM in our laptops. ;)
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Unfortunately, Alienware makes it so their current laptops cannot be upgraded, but with the graphics amplifier, the graphics card can. I got it with a good i7 and 16GB RAM, so I can upgrade my GTX 970 in another year or so.
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Yeah, weird they went that route. I personally prefer everything to be in the machine so I don't have to carry two things :)
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No kidding. I do have the 970M, so I can always just use that, but I never go anywhere, so it's no problem. I've always used laptops, because my back was so bad, I couldn't sit in a chair. I had to lay on the couch Roman style and had the laptop on a small table. Now that my back is better and I have a good chair, I wish it could be upgraded, or had a desktop. However, my CPU is more than enough for gaming and current GPUs. I could use a bigger screen, but otherwise, I like what I have.
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When I am at home put my laptop on my dresser, & I connect to my 47" 120Hz/1ms response time 1080p HDTV in my bedroom for a bigger screen. I just lay in bed with a wireless keyboard on my lap & my wireless Logitech G602 mouse at my side on the bed. I go into ultra lazy mode when I am home.
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^ Sounds like lazy good fun :D
I'm pretty much stuck at my desk with my 27" 1440p 165Hz G-Sync screen and that's it. Have a 4K TV as well, but that's upstairs in front of the bed distracting me and my gf before sleep :D
...come to think of it, I could actually hook my big-a$$ laptop to the TV now that I'm not using it as my main rig. Dayum! Thanks for the spark in the train of thought, guys! :)
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For the small price of a hundred thousand dollars! This is great news but I will just wait for the prices to go down. Spending 2000 dollars on a laptop just to equal desktop's performance is not practical
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Most of you forget that by the time you buy a good screen, a nice keyboard and literally the WHOLE computer (mobo with all the bits, GPU, CPU, RAM, storage, extras) - the laptop suddenly is now not the more expensive option anymore... In fact, laptops these days are pretty good in terms of price-performance. It's just that you need to take into account that you're buying a WHOLE computer, not just 3 components...
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Desktop due to price
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Most people tend to ignore the fact that by the time you buy a good screen, a nice keyboard and literally the WHOLE computer (mobo with all the bits, GPU, CPU, RAM, storage, extras) - the laptop suddenly is now not the more expensive option anymore… In fact, laptops these days are pretty good in terms of price-performance. It's just that you need to take into account that you're buying a WHOLE computer, not just 3 components…
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only if a laptop had a good screen, keyboard and mouse... you have to pay me to use a laptop's screen, mouse and keyboard...
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Laptops don't come with mice. As for the screen and keyboard, laptops can come with as good or better, some even with a mechanical keyboard. Mine has a Samsung IPS screen, while most monitors still have TN screens. It has a membrane keyboard that is excellent, as good as any membrane and many mechanical keyboards. You would enjoy using them, but I'm not going to pay you.
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@Psychoman - My Alienware 18 has a very nice 18.4" IPS display. Modern laptops come even better equipped, with better screens and going even up to 4K with G-Sync. I clearly see you have not owned a more expensive laptop...
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And mine wasn't that expensive. $1600 for just the laptop, but that included 16gb RAM, IPS screen and dual cooling fans, one each for the CPU and GPU. A comparable desktop would cost more than that. An IPS screen is not cheap.
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No Vote I personally Dislike NVidia prices and shady biznazz practices
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Many laptops are upgradable and things like the graphics amplifier also make the Alienware future proof. Best of both worlds, mobile and desktop. That being said, for the first time I'd rather have a desktop. The lure of a larger screen and mechanical keyboard is pretty strong. Digital Storm makes future proof desktops and laptops, which is where I'll buy my next computer. Just ship the old one back to them and they upgrade anything for just the price of the parts. On a laptop, that includes CPU and GPU. Desktop the same. I'm too dumb to build my own :-(
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You know, before this big-a$$ rig I've never built a PC, honestly. You can learn everything on youtube and the interwebs. The motherboard connectors were the biggest pain in the butt, but a quick skim through the manual's diagrams made it somewhat clear :)
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Thanks for your vote of confidence, but working with my hands is a gift I don't have. I greatly admire those that can build their own, but I'm out of my element with things like that.
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It's easier than you think. Everything slots-in and is clearly labeled - you can't go wrong :)
There's no way to mess up the CPU (you match the triangles on the CPU and the socket), can't mess up the GPU (I/O shield goes to the back), no way to mess up the RAM (off-center cut makes it impossible to in the wrong way), all the cables are all different and labeled so you can mess those up, The cooler slots in pretty much any way (square bracket) and it's fine, the screws are all pretty clear, etc. Trust me, it's not hard. Confusing at first - yes. But I've built my rig in a few hours and you have to see my mobo to appreciate the complexity of that mo-fo!
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I've seen your rig and I can't stop the drooling :) You can't screw up pounding in a nail either, but I did. I broke three things: the nail, a finger and the hammer. How do you break a hammer? I was trying to pull the bent nail back out and the claw broke off the hammer. Wise old Lithuanian saying: If you don't know what you're doing, find someone that does!! My dad always told me that and it's one of the few things he told me that's true. That advice has served me well!
When the day comes, I'll have you stop in and build it. I'll provide beer!!
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Haha, maybe when I visit the States we could arrange that :D
I had to hang a big mirror on our bedroom wall last year. My gf was adamant she wants to do it. "independent woman" n all that. Ok... So I lay the mirror down on the floor and she needs to mark on the frame where to screw in the brackets. It's a big mirror. So she marks one end of the frame close to her. Then crawls onto the mirror to reach the other end of the frame xDDDD
Needless to say we needed a new mirror and I was the one hanging it xD
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I wouldn't credit the 1080 entirely to this, a laptop Polaris 11 card (the R9 M470X if I remember right) at 1400mhz will likely match my HD 7870 (with it at stock speeds) in a tiny form factor running cooly, this entire node shrink is pushing everything ahead
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Investing in a gaming laptop just doesn't seem right for most PC gamers out there, having to deal with high temperatures, and not being able to upgrade the GPU just seems like a bad idea. Sure if I had money to throw around I would, but most PC gamers don't have that kind of dough to toss around. When I got into PC gaming, I knew it was going to be upgrades every couple of years, not a new PC.
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I wonder what's the with the "oh noes, high temps!" being tossed around? SUre, laptops don't cool as well as a huge desktop could, but laptop parts are designed with that IN MIND. It's not like they get fried or anything. I've got an Alienware 18 with GTX 980M SLI, i7-4930MX and 32GB RAM. Sure the temps get on the high side when I push the overclocks (yes, that laptop also holds overclocks!) - but the thing just ploughs through everything! Been using it for years with no problem.
So why the temps scare?
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My old laptop stays around 85-90 c usualy... while web browsing or watching a video. It still works thou.
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Well that just indicates clogged-up cooling and/or deteriorated thermal paste. Sort both out and your laptop will do half that ;)
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I agree. My 75W GPU stays at about 67C and my fan is barely spun up.
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Before I got the graphics amplifier, my i7 quad core and GTX 970M never hit 61 degrees. When either hit 60, it's fan would kick on and get the Temps back down. They each have their own fan and keep the temperatures down, even doing a demanding game like The Witcher 3.
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Dektop.It's more comfortable and it's so satisfying for me to be build it up,customize parts and just see everything work.It's hard to describe,but I LOVE desktop
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that's same way i feel about it too
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Same! I still keep modding mine and it's glorious! :)
(though I still need to lay out the cold cathodes (red lamps glowing from below the PSU) and get the wiring done a bit better)
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Gaming Laptops have done me well over the past years but the strain from heat tends to become an issue. I sometimes worry when I have to play games like Rise of the Tomb Raider as temperatures go pretty high. I am interested to see how far this goes but this time ill build a desktop. Waiting for the GTX 1080 Ti and the KabyLake architecture to release.
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What laptop have you got? My Alienware 18 with similar specs (980M SLI, i7-4930MX - all overclocked) was cooling itself alright when gaming.
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I have a Sager 9377-S. Bought it when the 980M released so it has been a while. Most games worked pretty well until I played RoTR and it started throttling even under decent ventilation. Few days later my laptop started shutting off after 30 mins of boot. Diagnosed the issue and the mobo was damaged due to heat. CPU ran hotter than usual too. Would take more than $1000 to repair.
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Yeah that sucks. My 3 year old Alienware 18 rarely even hits 80 on very demanding games. Normally it stays below 76. Of course I made sure to get some OC Diamond put on my CPU and GPUs first thing. Sounds like you didn't have a good thermal paste application. Either that or the Sager is just too small to give proper airflow for that much hardware. :(
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Yes, it is unfortunate. I used to move a lot from country to country which is why I needed a laptop at that point. Since I have settled, I am planning to build a desktop this time. I am actually looking forward to it but its probably going to be a while until the new hardware releases. I believe ive learned a few things having this laptop so for my next rig, ill take extra precautions.
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Shame! I pasted my laptop (CPU and both GPUs) with Coollaboratories Liquid Ultra (liquid metal compound) for the best heat transfer. Those 980Ms run HOT under load :)
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For what it's worth, I'm just the messenger here, but when talking to Digital Storm about building a laptop, they told me there was no difference in the paste at all. Paste is paste and the rest is just marketing.
My Alienware 15 has the 970M, which is known to run cool. First time I've considered myself lucky for getting the lesser GPU, but its performance is almost the equal of the 980M. Almost.
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I agree that paste is paste for the most part, but how well it is applied means a world of difference. I don't trust the big name manufacturers to take their time when applying thermal paste. They are bad about leaving air bubbles or gaps in the paste application which means that there will be a poor conductivity for heat dissipation.
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@LeadStarDude Agreed. However, Digital Storm isn't a big time dealer. The custom and hand build everything. They spent a lot of time with me on the phone and emails. Looking back, my Alienware is less money, but I wish I had gone with Digital Storm. I could send it back for free upgrades (have to pay for the parts only) anytime for the life of the computer. Good outfit.
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Xidax has an excellent warranty and service. They even offer a laptop with a desktop i7-6700K & desktop GTX 980 on a 1080p IPS G-Sync screen. I am actually considering buying my next laptop from them once they start offering a newer version with a GTX 1080.
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No, smaller spaces is more heat, more heat is more strain and less durability.
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Modern and mobile cards especially are designed with that in mind. I wouldn't worry about it. Have a GTX 980M SLI laptop which I overclock, had my cards running at 95 degrees, nothing.
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Mine goes up to 75 C under 100% load in a hot room. It doesn't even throttle at that temp. The max temperature for laptop GPU's is 100 C.
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By the time I need an upgrade I won't be needing a laptop, so I'm definitely building a desktop.
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Just to correct the article - high end laptops are all modular so you CAN upgrade them. They use standard RAM nowdays, desktop CPUs, standard HDDs/SSDs and even MXM Graphics cards which you can swap.
If anyone remembers my laptop - that's a testament of upgradeability, where I literally doubled the performance by upgrading the parts after a couple of years (swapped the GPUs, the CPU, doubled the RAM and added a couple of terabytes worth of SSDs). Even overclocked the screen to a cool 110Hz!
Now that being said - if you're mobile, travel a lot, maybe even just space-conscious - a beastly laptop is obviously the way to go. But for ultimate performance...well..my rig speaks for itself.
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^Truth has been spoken.
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That being said, even before using desktop CPUs/GPUs/RAM high end laptops were completely modular years and years ago. It's just that not a lot of people actually buy them, so it's no surprise not everyone knows they CAN be upgraded!
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Sorry, but high end laptops are not "all" modular. Many of the 980m laptops are soldered on the main board not MXM (mine included). CPUs can be the same way. HDDs and ram was mostly upgradable though.
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Depends on what you call "high-end". I don't even look in the direction of those slim laptops. A fat laptop is where the cooling and the fun are :)
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I would say any laptop containing top of the line GPU by Nvidia is "high end".
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Needs to be able to cool itself too. A throttling bag of sh*t isn't high-end...
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Well, since I wasn't planning on selling a house, car, kidney or my whole family, I don't think I will be a proud owner of a gtx1080 laptop anytime soon
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maybe you can own one a few years from now when it's obsolete as dirt.... lol $50 on ebay anyone? xD
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I fully intend to replace my current laptop with a new one sporting a desktop GTX 1080 inside. Hopefully a full desktop Kaby Lake processor as well.
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Nope, only reason for someone to take laptop over desktop is that he needs mobility. Which was the case when I bought my laptop few years ago.
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Would take desktop over ANYTHING.Except a spaceship, would like to have a nice spaceship to fly around :P.But in all seriousnes laptops are nutorious for overheating (not all but most laptops) and also theres just something about when i see a desktop PC that just makes me happy inside.But if i had money i would probbably buy both..but that will probably never happen so desktop it is!
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i have a formula: crappy laptop for on-the-go work and gaming, a great desktop solely for gaming. i intend to stick to that formula. im guessing this laptop's gonna cost around $2000-3000 so I'll pass.
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But if you're starting a PC from crap a laptop will be a lot cheaper than desktop pc i think. First laptop will have everything you need. Monitor, CPU,GPU etc... Windows installed. The only think you might buy is a mouse.
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For pc you need a keyboard, monitor, mouse, cpu etc... if you're gamer you will propably want the latest techonology and will cost you around 2-3k maybe it will be less. But if you need only cpu then ofcourse dekstop pc will be cheaper.
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and there you have it. i will never be starting a pc from scratch. im gonna be swapping the gpu at some point with maybe the upcoming vega gpus. at some point im gonna have to buy a new laptop but ill be damned if i spend upto 2k on it.
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You have no idea how much my rig cost me. Built it completely from scratch because I had a laptop previously....
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I suppose something good around 4000$, but I don't think that you will find so powerful laptops even next year. You system is overkill! I hope you have at least a high refresh rate monitor.
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Oh yes, 27" 165Hz 1440p IPS G-Sync - one of the finest screens you can buy.
Regardless, I paid nearly £4500 here in UK for all the parts which in US dollars would be something like $6000...
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This PC you see on me i built it from scratch too. ANd i think it cost around 1900 leva which is around 971.45 Euro.
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without mouse,keyboard and monitor. I had this previously.
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That's a pretty solid build for the price, especially considering we get totally screwed over with prices in Europe :)
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well i think i could went for 780 but i'm not building my rig but with the money from my parents and i didn't wanted to be selfish and i went for 760. One of my friends told me that my mother board is worker board.
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I think it was gigabyte B85-something. And i have no problems with that. I could went for i7 CPU but i didnt. Next change of my rig will be with my GPU.
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i think laptops can maybe keep up if the standardize all video card interfaces like they did with PCI.
RAM and CPU's are already replaceable. PS not so much, but the video, at least my geforce9800m GTS in my ASUS G70SG was removable, and SLIable. The problem was
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if these things could be fixed, then the over lifespan of a laptop could be extended. MB replacement is out, but buy that time what are you really upgrading, you case?
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That's the frustrating thing. My Alienware 17 solves those issues, but then the second revision switches to soldered chips. So now my loyalty to Dell & Alienware comes to an end. My next laptop will likely be an MSI. But that will be a long time from now, as my Alienware 17 can still be upgraded. MXM FTW
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The MXM 3.0 standard has been in place since GTX 245M at LEAST, if I recall correctly, and still stands today with my GTX 980M cards. That's pretty standardised IMO. And of course the laptop will be hard to pull apart - there's so much space-saving design going on - that's the whole point! But once you do - you can upgrade and upgrade well. My Alienware 18 saw a 100% boost in performance once I swapped my GTX 780M SLI to 980M SLI (and I also swapped the CPU for an extreme series one, added more RAM and 2TB of SSDs, then overclocked my screen to 110Hz xD).
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@xquatrox Our laptops use the MXM 3.1b form factor. It offers a few more power connecting pins than previous versions. That allows for more powerful GPUs.
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I thought it was 3.0B. Can't find 3.1... Anyway, our ports are compatible down to MXM1, apparently so who cares.
Correction: yeah ours is 3.1B, but again - still backwards compatible
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Speaking of MXM, apparently the MXM page on Wikipedia got updated! It seems our laptops can offer 200W for our GPUs. Good to know.
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If I put two 200W GPUs in my laptop then not only the cooling wouldn't handle them - the PSU would not cope! I don't think it's as clear-cut as that...
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Well, that stuff kinda goes without saying. I feel like I could pull it off, so long as I can use your PSU. LOL
But even if I could I probably wouldn't. 200W just seems like too much.
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The biggest PSU I seen for laptops was 330W retail, that's what I have. If you have an AW M18X R1 or R2 you can use a modded PSU where you can bunch up 2 or more of those PSUs for 660W or 1kW for extreme overclocking. Mine and yours, unfortunately, have a limit, so the mod won't work. Mobo shuts down as soon as there's too much draw. Heck, even with my 980Ms and the i7-4930MX certain overclocks with certain games throttle due to insufficient wattage available to the components :D
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Does the 330W work with the 17?
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No clue. That's something you need to find out on the forums.
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I looked it appears not. Guess I'm shooting for a GTX 1070 instead.
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Desktop suits me, Laptops suit others.
I prefer Desktops 'cos you can essentially keep customizing it depending on your case and have better hardware for similar prices compared to laptops.
Whereas Laptops are for people who like to game on the go, though heat can be an issue, and Hardware customization can be an obstacle.
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Cool but i will wait for the 1060m to came out and buy my new laptop